~Marcos Burial Issues~

[Heathcliff]

Reds assail Duterte on Marcos burial plan



DAVAO DIE-IN Sprawling herself on the pavement, a woman dramatizes her protest against the planned burial of President FerdinandMarcos at Libingan ng mga Bayani during a rally in Davao City on Sunday.

LUCENA CITY—The Communist Party of the Philippines (CPP) has assailed President Duterte for his “bullheadedness” in allowing the burial of the dictator Ferdinand Marcos at Libingan ng mga Bayani.
“[Mr. Duterte] is determined to squander the historical lessons treasured by the Filipino people. They are being politically disarmed from preventing the rise to power of future dictators,” the CPP said in a statement issued on Saturday.
Mr. Duterte’s decision to allow the burial of Marcos at the heroes’ cemetery and the killings of hundreds of poor drug users and dealers have soured initially friendly relations between the President and the CPP.

The President, a former student of CPP founder Jose Maria Sison, has appointed leftists to his Cabinet.

Peace talks

He has also ordered a resumption of peace talks with the National Democratic Front of the Philippines to end one of the world’s longest-running communist insurgencies and bring peace to the countryside.

But Mr. Duterte, a friend of the Marcos family, has said he will allow the burial of the dictator at Libingan ng mga Bayani, sparking protests from thousands of survivors of martial law abuses, human rights advocates, current and former legislators and ordinary people linked to the opposition to the strongman.
He argues that Marcos deserves to be buried at Libingan because he was a soldier and a President, regardless of any misdeeds.

Plan condemned


The CPP condemned the plan of the Duterte administration to give Marcos a hero’s burial.
“By claiming Marcos deserves to be buried with other former soldiers, [Mr.] Duterte is helping perpetuate the historical lies surrounding Marcos’ bogus medals and phony Maharlika guerrilla unit,” it said.
By ordering that Marcos be accorded military honors befitting a former head of state, Mr. Duterte is “virtually deleting Marcos’ bloody record as a military despot and the fascist violence, human rights violation, corruption and economic hardships he made the Filipino people suffer through 14 years of dictatorship,” the CPP said.
Giving Marcos a hero’s burial “will complete the Marcoses’ political restoration and will complete the whitewash of all the crimes they perpetrated against the people,” it said.


Revising history


Mr. Duterte, by “flaunting” his alliance with the Marcos family, is helping the “Marcosian scheme to revise history and make the younger generations overlook the colossal plunder and sale of the country’s patrimony, his debt-borrowing spree, his legacy of gross cronyism, his family’s ostentatious lifestyle built upon the poverty of the people, and his martial law’s massacre of freedom and democracy,” the CPP said.

The President’s decision to allow Marcos’ burial at Libingan “displays extreme insensitivity to the sensibilities of thousands of victims, families and survivors of martial law,” it said.
“He insults the memory of thousands of patriotic Filipinos from all walks of life who gave up their lives at [their prime] to fight for the dictatorship’s overthrow,” the CPP said.


https://youtu.be/fEdoQ_LWqlw

https://youtu.be/aQIvAOd0-gQ

Credits to Inquirer News

[naruto789544]

this is a very delicate decision on the part of our president... but in my opinion, we cannot move forward if we keep on looking at the past... learn from it, keep the lesson but move ahead... only that way can we attain our goals...

[jobpar]

this is a very delicate decision on the part of our president... but in my opinion, we cannot move forward if we keep on looking at the past... learn from it, keep the lesson but move ahead... only that way can we attain our goals...

Agree po ako kay TS. Ang hirap kasi sa iba nakikita lang nila ung mga bagay na di maganda. Bakit di nila tignan mga Bright sides at mga nagawa/Naitulong.

[Heathcliff]

Hero or not...as the law says, 'former Presidents, soldiers, Secretary Of Defense..etc..." pwede ilibing doon.

I believe Marcos is qualified to be buried in LNMB.

I agree with you guys, Let's move on...and from what I've read somewhere..."Courtesy makes the nation Civilized"...so let's give Marcos his due burial as a civilized courtesy...

afterall there is no bravery in trying to inflict another death upon the dead. What good it would do to our nation? Bringing back the anguish of a painful past and nurturing only but hatred among our countrymen?

Let him be buried in peace but let us not forget what his regime has taught us.

Majority of the humble Filipinos always had it the hard way...let it be remembered always that from great sacrifices comes the pillars of a great Nation.

Thanks for all your comments in here guys!

 

[Dimmu Borgir]

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke..

The Marcos family is winning the propaganda war. In internet, forum, facebook etc. younger generations are already  brainwashed about the legacy of Marcos. Find a topic about Marcos and they have an explanation for this. But mostly their explanation are based on fabricated stories circulated in social media. But the sad reality here is they are twisting everything making the truth the lies and the lies became the truth..

This strategy is not new for the Marcoses, remember FEM, used the Maharlikan propaganda that's why he became president.

It is very easy for us to say move on at ilibing na yan sa LNMB because we are not the one who suffered the tyranny of the Marcoses. Eventhough natalo na sila ng isang class suit sa Hawaii regarding human rights, they still never issued a public apology. Tapos ngayon ililibing pa sa LNMB. Kung ikaw naman siguro ang biktima rito, mapapamura ka pag nangyari ito. Imagine, sa  100,000 na estimated na biktima ng martial law,  ito pa ang igaganti ng ating gobyerno? 

Move on na tayo. Wakasan na ang isyung ito. Dun sa Ilocos sya nababagay, period.. Sa dami nyang kasalanan sa atin, kahit palitan nya si Satanas ay pupwede..

Who is Marcos anyway? a convicted murderer at early age, (eventhough na inacquit sya ni laurel sa apela nya ay inamin naman niya na totoo ito kay Dr. Domingo Abella)

WTF! a public official who began his public career with murder for which he was convicted.  How nice !!!
 




 

[Heathcliff]

Sir,

I understand your predicament...but for how long will the filippinos go through with that kind of hatred like yours? I admist, you are good with history...but somehow your analysis dwells on a past that obviously you do not want to let go...

do you think...our country will thrive if we go on nurturing past mistakes of our government officials instead of opting for change and strive for a better government?

Must we always point a blaming finger on those persons na nagkamali nung nakaraan at hindi natin mismo isasakatuparan ang pagbabago...simula sa ating sarili?

gaya ng sabi mo...at ayon sa mga nailahad na...si Marcos ay DIKTADOR. He commited a lot of violations...Heis UNLAWFUL.

That was almost 30 years ago...must we continue to dig into his skeletons and wallow in hatred and be stucked with it?

Under the constitution...which was revised by Cory Aquino...and later on mandated by Fidel Ramos...nasan ang mali at nasan ang batas...na nagsasabi hindi pwede ilibing ang isang dating sundalo doon? O ang isang dating presidente?

would you rather...have a guard dog be burried at the LNMB instead of a former president of the Republic? ...is it unlawful? nasaan ang nilalabag na batas dyan?

maka konstitusyon ba ang reaksyon at opinyon na gaya ng sayo?

In my observation...personal ang opinyon mo..base sa mga doktrina o adhikain na gusto mong sundin...Even Joma Sison...have said, it is his right to be burried at the LNMB...

nasan ang mali dyan? kung batas ang pagbabatayan?

ano ba talaga ang punto dito? yung personal na opinyon o ang batas na dapat sundin?

...e kung bawat pilipino magkakaron ng ibang batayan ayon sa personal opinyon...magulo yan...para ano pa ang konstitusyon at ang batas na yan...na sila din ang bumalangkas pagkatapos e ganyan naman....

For all he's done...he 's dead now...let him be burried...and let the government do it's duty to the country...kung may dapat habulin...habulin....

...sa loob ng ilang dekada...nasan ba ang hinabol nila meron ba? kung meron man nasaan na?

at kung mayroon pa...walang pumipigil dyan ayon sa batas...kung nararapat...habulin yan.

kaso...kung sasabihin natin tuta si MARCOS ng amerika...e mukha naman itong mga sumunod e hindilang tuta...kundi alipin ... kung corrupt si MARCOS...di hamak na mas notorious ang corruption nung sumunod na mga gobeyerno..

pero..teka, ano naman kinalaman ng patay sa corruption? ANG PATAY NILILIBING YAN...ANG CORRUPT HINAHABOL YAN...regardless kung ano ang propaganda meron sila...kung paiiralin ang batas...at kung merong bayag ang hahabol at hindi rin corrupt.

wag mo ambisyunin habulin pa ang patay...you will go nowhere...

Filippinos MUST STOP WHINNING LIKE STUPID KIDS AND START AND OPT FOR A CHANGE FOR THE BETTER.

lol...trending sa FB at Twitter at iba pang social medias...propaganda?

ilibing na yan para tapos ang issue... the more na pinatatagal nila yan...they are only making him a martyr...nde ba nila naiisip yan?



....santa madonna!

[Dimmu Borgir]

tapos na ang isyu kung tutuusin, matagal ng inubos ng uod si Marcos sa ilocos, at kung pag uusapan naman natin yung sinasabi mong aso kuno ng mga Aquino na inilibing sa LNMB ay masasabi kong isa itong halimbawa ng mga kwento ng kasinungalingan na nagmumukhang totoo dahil hindi pinapabulaanan ng mga taong may alam.

 Ang binabanggit mong aso, para madagdagan ang kaalaman mo, ay isang military K9 dog na ang pangalan ay Shadow na nagserved bilang bomb sniffing dog nun panahon ni Cory at di sya inilibing sa LNMB katulad ng mga kumakalat sa social media kundi sa Malacanang Park, at customary talaga na inililibing ang mga aso na nagserbisyo at pwede talaga silang bigyan ng full military honors.

striving for a better government contradict this issue. why, because if you allowed marcos to be buried in the LNMB, this will send a strong message to all buwaya at mga ganid na nasa gobyerno na ok lang magnakaw habang nabubuhay dahil sa bandang huli, pwede ka naman palang mailibing sa libingan ng mga bayani.

i will share u a good insight...

noon si marcos lang ang corrupt pero ngayon, halos lahat na ng nasa gobyerno ay corrupt.

alam mo ba kung bakit?

dahil naipakita ni marcos na kahit magnakaw ka pa ng bilyong piso ay patatawarin ka ng mga pilipino at ito ngayon ang ginagamit bilang guiding principle ng mga pulitiko kaya katulad ni bongbong na nahuling nagsinungaling sa kanyang resume,  si binay na sa harap ng national tv eh nagsisinugaling.

and lastly,

at eto na naman tayo ngayon, using the K9 dog and fabricated story para magamit nilang argument para sa gusto nilang burial ni FEM.

History repeats itself.

FEM used the maharlikan lies to be a president and now, using the lies of k9 dog burial para mailbing sya sa libingan ng mga bayani.. 


bakit ganun na lang kakapal ang mukha nila?  kasi bobo ang tingin nila sa atin at sa tingin nila kahit anong panggagago ang gawin nila eh ayos lang sa atin..

[Heathcliff]

again, what you said is too perosnal based only on your anguish and hatred of the Past.

Let go...and opt for a change. There is no use crying and wallowing over a dead man's unlawful mistakes.

Do not give me those lame arguments about corrupt officials at present...IT'S THEIR OWN DOING AND IT'S THEIR OWN CHOICE.

Marcos have had his share of corruption during his regime. It stopped when he died.

As A Nation we should all strive to nurture faith and unity among us...inspite of and despite of all our adversities...If Marcos commited such horrible crimes on Human Rights...it won't lessen our self respect as a Nation to give back what is due him...a PROPER BURIAL....NOT AS A HERO...BUT AS A FILIPPINO. 

Hindi kailangan maging bitter sa nakaraan...ang isang nasyon hindi uunlad kung ganyan...matuto sa nakaraan...maging matatag sa kinabuksan... Corruption is everywhere...we all have to deal with it...starting with ourselves.

Hindi kailangan ng present generation ang pagtuturuan, ang sisihan...ang siraan ng kapwa opisyal ng gobeyerno...they are just wasting time...tulang ng iba na hindi maka move on sa ganitong issue....LET US NOT FOCUS ON THE PROBLEM...DEAL WITH IT WITH AN EFFECTIVE SOLUTION.

. . . .and whinning bitterly over a sad part of history isnt one of them.

Let it be a lesson. Let it be an example, though bad it maybe...but do let the people know about it...but DO NOT DWELL ON IT.

If Change is what we Filippinos want to have right now...then dwelling on such negativity is not the proper course to take.

[whinterwol]

This a really really good topic to talk about! Really nice!

Alam ko may may Law na kapag Unlawful yung tao di pde ilibing sa LNMB. I read it in a news article online sa Philippine Inquirer. But i cant seem to find it now. Natabunan na ata di ko na masearch eh. Lalagay ko sana yung link.

Tapos may agreement between marcoses and fidel ramos regarding dito. And the agreement was to allow FEM to be buried sa ibang lugar not LNMB.

These are both based sa nabasa ko. (not my opinion)

So, san dapat ilibing? Bahala na ang korte suprema. Sila lang mkakasagot ng tanong na yan.

Ang trabaho natin bilang mamamayan ngayon ay magplano para sa kinabukasan ng Pilipinas. Maging magiting, matalino, marangal, matino, at ibigay ang taos pusong serbisyo bilang Filipino para sa Filipino.

And if we continue in arguing with one another wala na talaga tayong patutunguhan kundi sa past.

"There is no Marcos or Aquino here. They are dead. There's just us. Filipinos. We live."

Basta mga kuya at ate, kung saan man ilibing yan, if he is NOT your hero then his burial sa LNMB should not change how you view him.

I have another thing in mind, feeling ko gawa gawa lang to ni duterte. Kasi people now are screaming moral logic. Eh di ba yung fight sa extra judicial killings moral issue rin. Parang gagamitin ata tong burial para masabi sa tao na "o ngayon moral issue kayo ng pag libing kay FEM. Eh yung issue ng pagpatay ng adik? inosenteng bata pinatay o nirape, di ba moral issue?"
Wala lang naisip ko lang. Haha!

[john.tamad12]

mga sir ganda ng usapan nyo ah. sakin po ok lang na ilibing si marcos sa lnmb kasi naging sundalo cya dati ww2, pero dapat ilagay dun kasi sundalo cya. pero kung totoo yung article na hindi cya pwdeng ilibing dun dahil may law o kasunduang legal tignan n lang po natin ang sasabihin ng sc....
para sakin dun ako sa ikaka unlad ng bayan...

[Dimmu Borgir]

natawa ako brod sa comment mo..

natawa naman ako sayo ms. schy, kailangan ba talagang sa LNMB pa ilibing para masabi mong proper burial? beside di naman lahat ng pangulo sa LNMB nakalibing, at di rin lahat ng sundalo eh nasa LNMB, ngayon bakit nila ipinagpipilitan ito samntalang dati naman ay pumayag na sila na dun sa Ilocos ilagay si FEM..

para sa akin may deeper na motibo pa sila dito. at ito yun sa palagay ko..

dahil syempre nga naman, pag sa LNMB inilagay ah mabubura nila ang ginawa nilng atrocites, magagamit nila itong argument especially sa mga kabataan para maging malinis sila at totally marewrite ang history pabor sa kanila,, for me, this is the master plan kaya sila nagppilit.. lalo na at tamad ang mga millenials ngayong maghnap kung ano talaga ang katotohanan, ang dali nilang maniwala sa mga fabricated na mga memes o mga video.

Di naman ako bitter sa nakaraan pero sa tingin ko, ayon na rin kay Lee Kuan Yew, masyadong malambot at mapagpatawad ang kultura natin at isa ito sa tingin nya bakit ang Pilipinas naghihirap at totoo naman ito.. Kailangan natin talaga ng disiplina at dapat mag umpisa ito sa mga lider natin.

Delicadeza, di ito nasusulat sa konstitusyon pero ito ang dapat na mayroon sila..

 

[SandAccess]

Kapag kasi marcos ang usapan, dami talaga reactions jan.. sa akin lang, naging pangulo at sundalo nman cya eh di ilibing na lang sa LNMB.. then move-on.. matagal nman nang patay yung tao.. Hindi nman ibig sabihin na kung inilibing ka sa LNMB eh automatic sa langit na ang punta mo.. dba?! Yun eh opinyon ko lang, at naniniwala ako na ang "past" dapat kasunod "move forward".. then dapat "we learned from the past."...

[naruto789544]

there are always two sides of a discussion and it would really depend on whose side you are with... both have valid points... but for me, the biggest issue here is unity... our country would never move forward if we wallow in the past... if many say he was a dictator, then so be it... but that would never erase the fact that he was a former president and a soldier as well... and that alone is reason for him to be buried there... when the time comes that our other recent past presidents will be laid to rest, do you think people will question it if they will be laid to rest at the same place?  remember, they all have their own skeletons in their closets...

[Heathcliff]

natawa ako brod sa comment mo..

natawa naman ako sayo ms. schy, kailangan ba talagang sa LNMB pa ilibing para masabi mong proper burial? beside di naman lahat ng pangulo sa LNMB nakalibing, at di rin lahat ng sundalo eh nasa LNMB, ngayon bakit nila ipinagpipilitan ito samntalang dati naman ay pumayag na sila na dun sa Ilocos ilagay si FEM..

para sa akin may deeper na motibo pa sila dito. at ito yun sa palagay ko..

dahil syempre nga naman, pag sa LNMB inilagay ah mabubura nila ang ginawa nilng atrocites, magagamit nila itong argument especially sa mga kabataan para maging malinis sila at totally marewrite ang history pabor sa kanila,, for me, this is the master plan kaya sila nagppilit.. lalo na at tamad ang mga millenials ngayong maghnap kung ano talaga ang katotohanan, ang dali nilang maniwala sa mga fabricated na mga memes o mga video.

Di naman ako bitter sa nakaraan pero sa tingin ko, ayon na rin kay Lee Kuan Yew, masyadong malambot at mapagpatawad ang kultura natin at isa ito sa tingin nya bakit ang Pilipinas naghihirap at totoo naman ito.. Kailangan natin talaga ng disiplina at dapat mag umpisa ito sa mga lider natin.

Delicadeza, di ito nasusulat sa konstitusyon pero ito ang dapat na mayroon sila..

Alin ang nakaktawa sa sinabi ko Dimmu?

if that's your way of reasoning and your viewpoint in any argumentation you will encounter here specially if the argument is against your opinion...that's your prerogative. But let me remind you...the matter here concerns only if Marcos is qualified to be burried in LNMB. I need not emphasize here his qualifications..and if the Human Rights Activists insist on their protestations..let them prove it. But again...wala na ba talagang ibang recourse kund ibalik yang nakaraan at ipakita sa buong mundo na na hindi natin kayang tanggapin yang flaw na yan sa ating history?

There are greater evils in the history of this world...Germany for instance...every year, inaalala ang nangyari sa mga jews...nandyan ang  Auschwitz to prove Germany's cruel legacy...but look at Germany now...nasaan ba sya ngayon?

Wag ka tumawa...dahil walang nakakatawa sa istoryang yan....hindi lang isang lahing aleman ang nais burahin ng Germany noon...kundi lahat ng Jews..at damay ang ibang bansa..but still Germnay remained a world power until now...

bakit hindi ang Pilipinas? palagay mo...?

Dahil hindi tayo makausad...hindi tayo maka move on.

Puro na lang nakaraan...at sa nakaraan...laging negatibo.

And that makes the whole nation CRIPPLED!

DELICADEZA?! nasan ang delicadeza ng mga nadoktrinahan ng di umanong makabayang doktrina? ...hindi ba si Joma Sison...nasa Switzerland? saang lupalop ba ng europe yan nandun? palagay mo...nararanasan ba nya yung buhay ng mga rebelde na namundok at tinalikuran yung normal na buhay? Habang ang ilan nasa kulungan yung iba...nagpapasasa sa kapangyarihan? Nasan ang doktrina na mga komunista na yan?

...nasan ang ideology na pinaglalaban nila? Plagay mo..meron ba silang delicadeza?

sa tagal ng partidong yan...ano bang pagbabago ang ginawa nyan?

ah meron! binago nyang partidong yan yung mga buhay nung mga matatalinong taong pinagpalit yung chance nilang mas malayang ipaglaban yung karapatan ...ipiangpalit sa pamumundok...sa pagrerebelde...ang tanging gamit...yung NEGATIBONG NAKARAAN......

wala dyan ang pagbabago...wala sa bundok! wala sa pagrerebeldeng pagtanaw sa negatibong nakaraan.


...hindi yan nakakatawa.

nakakaiyak na yan.

ilang dekada pa...ilang generation pa...

kapag nahirati ang ilan sa ganyang mentality...

nakakatawa na marahil...dahil ang pilipinas mapupuno ng talangka...

hindi lang sa dagat...kundi na rin sa lupa.

Mga talangka...sa ibabaw ng BANDILA.

yang LNMB...isang kapirasong lupa lang yan...ipagdadamot pa.

...palagay ko yung delicadeza nde na sinasabi sa patay yan...dun na lang sa mga buhay...dun sa mga Pilipinong panay ang reklamo at panay ang husga...wala naman magawa kundi hilahin pabalik ang istorya...wala na ba talagang bago dyan?!


FYI ..di ko sinabing 'proper burial" ...magback read ka. Dont put lame words into what I wrote here...I am starting to believe that your arguments are getting weak and too lame kaya ganyan na way of reasoning mo.

Again..we may disagree and argue here...but matutong irespeto ang opinyon ng iba.

Walang mawawala sa inyo kung ibibigay nyo yan sa kapwa forumer nyo.

[Dimmu Borgir]

im sorry mali pala yung pagkakasabi ko, di mo nga pala nabanggit yung "proper burial", tama ka na ang LNMB ay isang piece of land, pero ang tanong nga dito eh bakit ba nagpipilit sila na dun ilibing si Marcos? Ano bang meron sa LNMB na wala sa ibang libingan? Nasabi ko na nga na yung ibang dating presidente eh di naman dun nakalibing pero di naman sila nagpipilit na ilipat dun.. Di ba "at peace" si Marcos sa Ilocos samantalang naka aircon pa nga siya dun?

Para sa akin, hindi lang ito simpleng nakaraan. Nakataya dito ang kasaysayan natin na pilit nilang binubura pabor sa kanila. Wag sana nating hayaang mangyari ito. Ipaglaban natin kung ano ang tama at totoo. Kung di nila pilit na binabago ang nakaraan, wala naman sigurong magrereact. Sa ngayon marami pa rin ang nakakaalam ng totoo kaya asahan natin na di nila hahayaang magtampumpay ang pamilya marcos sa kanilang hangarin.

Di ko alam kung bakit nasama dito si Joma Sison pero gusto ko rin malaman mo ako mismo ay di sumasang ayon sa armadong pakikibaka nila pero siguro naman di natin maikakaila na may mga naitutulong din sila sa atin.

At lalong di ako sumasang ayon sa pananaw mo na tanging ang "negatibong nakaraan lamang ang sandalan nila ng pagrerebelde" dahil ang katotohanan ay ang kasalukuyang epidemya ng paghihirap, kawalan ng opurtunidad, di patas na pagtrato ng pamahalaan at mga kaso ng pang aabusong militar ang ilan lamang sa dahilan kung bakit may mga umaakyat pa rin sa bundok...

cool ka lang ms. schy.....